Today I learned the sizing dumpster fire begins in infancy. I bought Carter's overalls for my twin godsons. They are 6 months old. I bought size 12 months so they'd have clothes to grow into in the fall - helping out their parents. Mom said, "Those overalls are the cutest things. They fit perfectly." When I exclaimed that I'd bought them for future she said, "Hmph, I don't know if my babies are giant or the sizing is completely wrong, but these boys wear a 12 now." I add, they are the cutest little rug rats ever?
I had not given thought to the name Banana Republic although, certainly I am well aware of the reference in the political context. What I didn't know was this. "The phrase banana republic was first coined in 1904 by American writer O. Henry." Now we covet the O. Henry prize, the oldest major prize for short fiction in America. Odd, the changes language usage undergoes and the powers that usher in the change.
This is so interesting! It's also really difficult to find pants that fit if you're short (like moi). Whenever I buy pants, I have to factor tailoring into the budget because more often than not, I'll need to get the pants hemmed. Sometimes the tailoring is more expensive than the pants! It's also frustrating because there's no instant gratification...I can never just walk out of the store and wear the pants the next day...I have to take them to the tailor, wait a week to wear them, etc. The whole thing is just a total pain!
I found this fascinating. It has not been my experience. It was interesting that you highlighted the Gap family. I do not have a history with Gap or Old Navy but for years I shopped almost exclusively at Banana Republic and Banana Republic Factory where I find sizing consistent across the board. The only items I ever returned were items that didn't stand up in quality.
I also wear the identical size at two other go-to stores. I'm a straight size and proportioned pretty much in the way most clothes my size are cut by mainstream manufacturers. Sizing has never been my issue. I'd go so far as to say that 98% of the pieces I order online fit near perfectly. These are big box, moderately priced stores. I assume that high end sizing would be dramatically different. Since my purse will never afford high end, I haven't that to worry about.
I will say that dependable sizing is not the case for lesser known brands, particularly those I have ordered from ThredUp, Poshmark, and Ebay, which are all over the map. I've ordered items where a large is a size 8. I've learned not to order online second hand outside my preferred brands.
I appreciate so many things about this. I somehow never seem to get measuring myself right, though, particularly when I sew. I watched your video, have watched this one (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQ1qHaTp1yg) have done my own over and over, and I always end up sewing things that are WAY off size, especially on the bottom. Has anyone else experienced this? I find myself hesitant to continue sewing for this reason, which I was really getting into for a while.
I have experienced that and all I can say (and maybe a more experienced seamstress can chime in) is that sometimes the numbers just don't correlate to the body. Like, numbers are just so linear and flat and our bodies are not. Again, I want to hear from more experienced sewers, but I wonder if you can get into the ballpark and do a basting stitch and then alter it on your own body from there.
I think it's also important to note that women's bodies don't scale in the same way men's do. If you disregard variations in the midsection for a moment, a much larger percentage of men have very similar proportions between neck, chest, and hip circumferences. Women? All over the place. Boobs! for one thing. They can be big, small, high, low, differently shaped, in a totally different relationship to armholes and ribcage. Two women can be size 12 and if a dress is drafted for a C cup, it's going to look awful on an A cup even if everything "fits". It's generally not possible to take a nicely fitting pattern for a straight size and just size up using normal pattern gradation. The proportions very quickly become hilariously (or tragically) off. I have no window into the inner workings of the fashion world but my guess is that very few brands know how to replicate their styles at larger sizes because they don't study larger bodies and understand how the pattern grading has to be different.
Come over the to dark side of making your own clothes when possible! It's fun and we have sharp scissors to slice the patriarchy into shreds.
Yes, the boobs! I’m busty and short. I can buy a button up shirt in a size that usually fits and it will not close over the girls. And when the doctor tries to talk to me about my weight I suggest we weigh my breasts, subtract that and go from there. They don’t know what to say to me when I suggest this!
A friend of mine who has done work in developing clothing patterns and designs for industrial production tells me that the allowable margin for acceptable finished variation is 2". That is, if you are making a size 10 and the waist is supposed to finish at 30", it's acceptable if it ends up between 29" and 31". The gradation between sizes is typically 2": if you look at a sizing chart, a lot of them will have size measurements that go 28", 30", 32", 34", etc.
So if the acceptable variation is 2" and the difference between sizing is 2" it's very possible to find that you fit into two of the exact same garment from the same company but one is a size 16 and one is a size 18, or whatever.
I'm so glad for this information, because that is often the case!! Incredible. Might even edit the post and add this in with attribution to you or just a generic "I've been told" if you are amenable to that.
Feel free to include it! No need to reference me as I'm only repeating what I've been told. I learned it from Carol Kimball, who has a site with lots of great information on sewing and fit issues: https://carolkimball.net/about/
Carol also has a Patreon which readers can find by searching her name on Patreon. Carol tells me she learned this info from Kathleen Fasanella, "from either her Fashion Incubator website or her book The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Sewn Product Manufacturing".
I haven't yet, although the dress coming out Friday and the silk t shirts have me tempted again. I do know they now have an American return address to make it less costly for returns. I'll keep you posted if I pull the trigger.
Today I learned the sizing dumpster fire begins in infancy. I bought Carter's overalls for my twin godsons. They are 6 months old. I bought size 12 months so they'd have clothes to grow into in the fall - helping out their parents. Mom said, "Those overalls are the cutest things. They fit perfectly." When I exclaimed that I'd bought them for future she said, "Hmph, I don't know if my babies are giant or the sizing is completely wrong, but these boys wear a 12 now." I add, they are the cutest little rug rats ever?
Expensive but I wish more places used the Pari Passu process of offering both shapes and sizes. One to watch for sales. https://paripassushop.com/pages/but-first-shape
I have always really been intrigued by that brand but it's never exactly fit the exact needs of a client. I love the style!
I had not given thought to the name Banana Republic although, certainly I am well aware of the reference in the political context. What I didn't know was this. "The phrase banana republic was first coined in 1904 by American writer O. Henry." Now we covet the O. Henry prize, the oldest major prize for short fiction in America. Odd, the changes language usage undergoes and the powers that usher in the change.
This is so interesting! It's also really difficult to find pants that fit if you're short (like moi). Whenever I buy pants, I have to factor tailoring into the budget because more often than not, I'll need to get the pants hemmed. Sometimes the tailoring is more expensive than the pants! It's also frustrating because there's no instant gratification...I can never just walk out of the store and wear the pants the next day...I have to take them to the tailor, wait a week to wear them, etc. The whole thing is just a total pain!
I found this fascinating. It has not been my experience. It was interesting that you highlighted the Gap family. I do not have a history with Gap or Old Navy but for years I shopped almost exclusively at Banana Republic and Banana Republic Factory where I find sizing consistent across the board. The only items I ever returned were items that didn't stand up in quality.
I also wear the identical size at two other go-to stores. I'm a straight size and proportioned pretty much in the way most clothes my size are cut by mainstream manufacturers. Sizing has never been my issue. I'd go so far as to say that 98% of the pieces I order online fit near perfectly. These are big box, moderately priced stores. I assume that high end sizing would be dramatically different. Since my purse will never afford high end, I haven't that to worry about.
I will say that dependable sizing is not the case for lesser known brands, particularly those I have ordered from ThredUp, Poshmark, and Ebay, which are all over the map. I've ordered items where a large is a size 8. I've learned not to order online second hand outside my preferred brands.
I appreciate so many things about this. I somehow never seem to get measuring myself right, though, particularly when I sew. I watched your video, have watched this one (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQ1qHaTp1yg) have done my own over and over, and I always end up sewing things that are WAY off size, especially on the bottom. Has anyone else experienced this? I find myself hesitant to continue sewing for this reason, which I was really getting into for a while.
I have experienced that and all I can say (and maybe a more experienced seamstress can chime in) is that sometimes the numbers just don't correlate to the body. Like, numbers are just so linear and flat and our bodies are not. Again, I want to hear from more experienced sewers, but I wonder if you can get into the ballpark and do a basting stitch and then alter it on your own body from there.
I think it's also important to note that women's bodies don't scale in the same way men's do. If you disregard variations in the midsection for a moment, a much larger percentage of men have very similar proportions between neck, chest, and hip circumferences. Women? All over the place. Boobs! for one thing. They can be big, small, high, low, differently shaped, in a totally different relationship to armholes and ribcage. Two women can be size 12 and if a dress is drafted for a C cup, it's going to look awful on an A cup even if everything "fits". It's generally not possible to take a nicely fitting pattern for a straight size and just size up using normal pattern gradation. The proportions very quickly become hilariously (or tragically) off. I have no window into the inner workings of the fashion world but my guess is that very few brands know how to replicate their styles at larger sizes because they don't study larger bodies and understand how the pattern grading has to be different.
Come over the to dark side of making your own clothes when possible! It's fun and we have sharp scissors to slice the patriarchy into shreds.
Yes absolutely, that's why the women's chart never really worked, because apparently it tried to cover many of these combinations and variables 😳
Yes, the boobs! I’m busty and short. I can buy a button up shirt in a size that usually fits and it will not close over the girls. And when the doctor tries to talk to me about my weight I suggest we weigh my breasts, subtract that and go from there. They don’t know what to say to me when I suggest this!
THIS IS INCREDIBLE!!!!!!!! I want to stand up and applaud! 👏
🤣
LOL at your scissors comment! Yessss!!!
A friend of mine who has done work in developing clothing patterns and designs for industrial production tells me that the allowable margin for acceptable finished variation is 2". That is, if you are making a size 10 and the waist is supposed to finish at 30", it's acceptable if it ends up between 29" and 31". The gradation between sizes is typically 2": if you look at a sizing chart, a lot of them will have size measurements that go 28", 30", 32", 34", etc.
So if the acceptable variation is 2" and the difference between sizing is 2" it's very possible to find that you fit into two of the exact same garment from the same company but one is a size 16 and one is a size 18, or whatever.
I'm so glad for this information, because that is often the case!! Incredible. Might even edit the post and add this in with attribution to you or just a generic "I've been told" if you are amenable to that.
Feel free to include it! No need to reference me as I'm only repeating what I've been told. I learned it from Carol Kimball, who has a site with lots of great information on sewing and fit issues: https://carolkimball.net/about/
Carol also has a Patreon which readers can find by searching her name on Patreon. Carol tells me she learned this info from Kathleen Fasanella, "from either her Fashion Incubator website or her book The Entrepreneur’s Guide to Sewn Product Manufacturing".
I hope that helps!
amazing! I'll add!
I definitely feel this, especially as my sizing has been changing.
One company that I’ve found really helpful in helping determine the right size for items I’m looking at is Lora Gene!
that's amazing, such a great brand. Have you ordered from them? The shipping and return fees have kept me from recommending to american clients.
I haven't yet, although the dress coming out Friday and the silk t shirts have me tempted again. I do know they now have an American return address to make it less costly for returns. I'll keep you posted if I pull the trigger.